Clay,
Thanks for sharing. Is the Savage Brothers 20 kg table top tempering machine considered continuous tempering? It does require running water input to speed up cooling.
See: http://www.savagebros.com/p.26/50-lb-20-kg-table-top-chocolate-melter-conditioner.aspx
Hello,
I use a Chocovision X3210 (purchased through TCL). I temper small test batches without seed by selecting tempering mode 2 and then just waiting a little while. It works pretty well. The problems I've had are mostly because I jumped the gun on molding.
For normal production, I use seed chocolate as it's much quicker and more consistent.
I'm not sure if your last comment is calling the Chocovisions continous tempering machines or not. They're batch tempering machines, not continuous. The continuous ones, as Clay describes, continuously cycle the chocolate through the tempering process and then back into a melting tank.
I like my X3210 just fine, but I really want to get a continuous temperer for the time savings that Clay mentions.
Ben
Hi Clay
Thank you for going intosuch detail, very interesting and broadens my knowledge, will probably have to read it a few times to get it to sink in! 
Can I ask about the Chocovision X3210 and Delta machines. I asked Duffy (UK)concerningtempering in his early days before he got his Selmi machineand he said that due to the fans on the machine not being effective enough he would take a ladle out and cool on a marble slab and then re-introduce it back into the batch. I'm not sure which machine he was using but think it may have be an earlier Chocovision.
How do the X3210 and Deltacompare now and can you or someone clarify how these machines arebest used aroundchocolate that has never been tempered before. Maybe I just haven't got my head around it yet but watching the videos on these machines and seeing all examples using seed behind the baffle leave me a little confused. Are you able to add the chocolate, maybe even pre melted and then take the machine through a program that brings the chocolate down to 26c and then back up to 32c?
The continuous temper feature of these machines is clearly the big selling point and one I think I really need, just want to understand the physical process before getting one.
Thanks Rob
Rob:
Continuous tempering machines (like the ones from FBM, Selmi, and others) do not require the use of seed chocolate, as is required in batch tempering machines. You do not need to purchase a large capacity machine to get the advantages of continuous tempering technology, you can get machines with bowl capacities of 4-12 kg, which can translate to 10-35kg of tempered chocolate per hour.
Continuous tempering machines work by keeping the chocolate melted in a working bowl. The chocolate is pumped through a cooling pipe and subject to shear force to start the formation of the proper crystal structure and then spread the crystals through the chocolate. When the chocolate leaves the cooling pipe and exits the spout it is in temper. Unused chocolate is returned to the working bowl where the crystals are melted out before the chocolate is pumped through the cooling pipe again.
Without going into too much detail (which would fill a book - which I am in the process of writing), there is a balance that needs to be maintained between the temperature of the melted chocolate in the bowl and the temperature of the cooling pipe. The temperature of the cooling pipe is lower than the temper point - what is important is that the temperature of the chocolate as it leaves the cooling pipe is correct. Often (usually), the melting point and the temper point are different in a continuous tempering machine than they are when hand or batch tempering.
The advantages of continuous over batch tempering (in addition to not requiring seed) are:
From a cold start, you can start work in 20-30 minutes or less in a continuous temperer. From a warm start (melted chocolate in the bowl) it can be less than 10. In even a small batch temperer you can be talking 30 minutes to an hour or more.
No long waits between batches. In a batch temperer, when you finish a bowl of chocolate you have to wait for a new batch to temper - which may or may not involve manual intervention. That might take an hour or more to get ready - a long break in the middle of a busy production schedule. With a continuous tempering machine the warm restart (add melted chocolate when the bowl is down by 25-33%) is extremely fast. This is why you can get 2.5 to 3.5x the bowl capacity in hourly throughput.
More consistent crystallization. Because of the nature of the system, most continuous tempering machines are better at holding a chocolate in temper throughout a long working day and can tolerate changes in the ambient environment automatically. Especially, the chocolate has a tendency not to thicken up over the course of a long shift. This is because the crystals are constantly being melted out and the chocolate is being re-tempered. All modern continuous tempering machines have computers on them to regulate the tempering process. With a batch or in hand-tempering, the operator has to have the experience to know what to do when the chocolate goes out of temper.
Please note that a continuous tempering machine (or any tempering machine, actually) is not a substitute for knowing how to hand-temper chocolate. Anyone who is experienced at hand-tempering chocolate will be able to get the best out of any tempering machine, irrespective of the technique employed.
Hi Felipe
Thanks for your input!
I am also looking at a melter now, an 8kgKeychoc machine which I have seen used before. I was also looking at using the technique that Brad Churchill uses which does not require the need for seed: http://www.thechocolatelife.com/forum/topics/tempering-untempered-chocolate?commentId=1978963%3AComment%3A42084
I have currently been tempering either on a marble slab or separating the melted chocolate, with the one bowl going into the freezer to bring it down to the required temperature and re-introducing it back.
Can I ask, how does the larger Selmi Tempering machines work on the principle of not having seed to use. That's some way off butI would like to know at some point there is a machine that does it for you.
Regards
Rob
Hi Robert,
I ended up buying a 6kg Mol d'Art chocolate melter with a spare bowl. I've been happy with the machine but sometimes wish I'd bought the larger 12kg one.
The Mol d'Art's are good for bean to bar because they are very affordable, easy to operate and allow you to learn different tempering techniques. The down side is they are slow to melt so I normally leave them with a block overnight or go straight from the bowl. A large microwave will be a good companion if you go this route. Just make sure not to burn the chocolate on the microwave as it does tend to happen
For bean to bar you have to face two scenarios: flexibility when tempering new origins/formulations without seed, but also speed to temper your regular batches. If you run 2 or 3 4kg Ultra/Santha machines, you'll soon see tempering as a bottleneck in production. The absence of seed is only a problem on your first batch for a particular formulation.
If you are making bars as opposed to dipping, my guess is to go with the larger Mold D'art first and, if production increases go for a small melter from Savage Bros which have consistently good reviews.
Hope it helps.
Felipe
Hi Felipe
I am looking at the chocovision machines you were looking at. I like you do not have any seed due to carrying out the whole bean to bar process. Did you come to any conclusions about which is the better machine at this level.
Rob
I am evaluating the Chocovision X3210 and Delta. It is attractive that the addition of the holey baffle can temper 6-8kg of chocolate made from the bean. Yet, from what I read it seems that the Chocovision X3210 andDelta are primarily designed for tempering using the seed method using blocks of chocolate which are later taken out.
Can the Chocovision machines temper without seed chocolate? Does it add significant time in waiting for the chocolate to cool down? I know I could extract some chocolate and cool it in the countertop while stirring to seed but this means it wouldn't be possible to extract it at the right time.
I've read glowing reviews of the Savage Bros 50lb countertop temperers as well as good comments on the smaller Pavoni Mini-Temper which holds only 3kg. Any other options I should consider for primarily bar moulding applications on a small scale?
Felipe
Well, the problem with 'the best chocolate' is that everyone believes they already have it 8-) it's a nebulous definition. Columbian beans can be absolutely wonderful. Think about what flavor profile you want; have a target in mind, and then work to custom taylor your beans to that profile. I would urge you to identify a partner to work with that has the ability to source a large amount of beans at a given time (ie more than a single family with 20 trees) as fermentation quantities are important. Start to play around with various fermentation protocols and drying methods and roast conditions until you find a flavor you're after. I would not simply identify a family, and ask them for beans, as you'll end up getting a highly variable result - if you liked it this time, you better really like it because you probably won't ever get it again.
Sebastian,
Thank you for your input, it is full of insights as always. It is interesting to hear of the DR's move to a wet bean buying model. I heard something similar from the Cacao Federation in Colombia looking to get more control over the post-crop practices.
I have found the Minifie book has some more in-depth information on post-crop and harvesting. I also found this presentation covering some GAP (Good Agricultural Practices) in Cacao.
Let me give you some background info: I am looking to make the best chocolate in Colombia. I have been working with Esmeralda, Atacames beans and some Santander ones as a source but I am getting closer to farmers by meeting relatives of them in Bogot. It is incredibly exciting when I visit a caprentry shop and the guy helping me says: My family has been planting cacao in the Meta regions for generations!
As I move forward I want to be better prepared to make an educated assesment as to the bean and post crop practices.
I am lucky to have an established company in the software business which lets me pursue chocolate without a strong commercial focus but most of my attention is centered on learning and moving forward with better chocolate production. A quest for great taste is a good guide.
Of course. I'd say, generally speaking, post harvest practices vary wildly almost everywhere, and there's a very, very low level of understanding on most farmers part of what good agricultural practices are, and the importance of good post harvest practices are and how they translate to the final product (or even what the final product is, which is a shame!). In every origin, you'll find extremes - those who know it very well, and those who don't - Columbia is no different than others in this regard.
The DR has moved largely to a wet bean buying model over the last 5 years - which has been a bit transformational for the farmer. It's much less labor for them, reduces the risk of theft, and speeds up their cash flow cycles. Most origins aren't sufficiently coordinated to do this on a large scale, and the more we see co-ops rise, the more this will change. The co-opfermentationapproach should, under the right guidance, lead to increased consistency, reduced defects (you'd hate to have highly consistent defects - which is what some origins have), which in turn should lead to a sustainable business model if the profits are applied thoughtfully for the future - one problem is many farmers don't think much about the future as they're so very focused on meeting their immediate needs. The more tools we can provide to prepare for the future, the better, and this includes not onlytrainingaround GAP's and quality, but soil nutrition, planting materials, education, health care, IPM, etc.
I'm unclear on what you're question is or what your goal is - if you're looking for a book to read to teach you how to do this, i don't think you're going to find one. If you're looking to create an organization that follows through to commercial sales, I'd urge you to contract or partner with someone who has some experience here vs trying to go it alone.
Thomas, thank you for sharing you experience.
It seems like the cooperatives have a lot of control over the bean choices as well as fermenting and drying. With clear guidelines and a monetary incentive for better practices there may be enough motivation to provide fine beans at a farm or cooperative level.
Thank you Sebastian.
I guess a critical step in improving quality would be to get growers to actually taste chocolate made from different quality beans. I guess cooperatives would be able to learn small batch chocolate making to not only learn the differences themselves but also to educate growers and buyers into what fine cacao tastes like in a finished product.
Are there any resources you would recommend to be better prepared technically when meeting growers/cooperatives? The Beckett book has limited information on fermenting and Genetic Diversity of Cacao by Bartley seems to focus on the plants and not post-crop activities.
Also, have been to Colombia? What was your impression of the practices in the farms or cooperatives you visited? I am yet to get a clear picture of the state of the cacao industry in the different regions and specially how suitable it is for producing fine flavor beans.
Regards,
Felipe
From what I understand, the cooperatives pay the same price the family run businesses pay for cacao There is a RD$500 difference paid for fermented and not fermented. If I remember right, it comes to US$800 per ton. The advantage to joining a cooperative comes with the technical assistance, getting organically certified, availability of loans, and 10% goes into projects within communities of their members. This is the "fair trade" cacao which accounts for about 25% produced. How much is fermented, I do not know. Many of the medium sized farmers have the same relationship with the bigger family run business. They probably have the sustainability certifications. The cooperatives have the fermentation boxes; more and more is being brought in wet from the fields. I will see how the pricing for the wet cacao is calculated this summer.
Actually, a great deal of the commercially available beans have remarkably great traceability. Some origins are obviously much, much better than others, but the traceability systems, in general, are better than you might expect.
Felipe - I've found that, generally speaking, unless the farmer has specifically asked me for something, my presence can often be perceived as an intrusion. When the tall white guy shows up, telling you to do something different than you've done for generations, there's almost always a skepticism. Often times a farmer doesn't realize he has a problem. Almost always he has no idea what his beans are used for, so how could he know what quality is? And they're often quite proud of their heritage and what they do - which is great. But it can make asking them to do something different difficult - even if it will dramatically improve their yield, reduce their disease, etc.
In the event someone has helped him understand quality, there's often conflicting information - ie i may tell him to do one thing (because that results in the outcome im' interested in), whereas someone else may tell him not to do that (because they want a different outcome).
The most effective way, imo, is to build a relationship that's mutually beneficial, and be overt about what you're asking them to do and why, showing them the results of both the good and the bad so they understand.
I can only speak from my experiences in the Dominican Republic and chocolate makers and companies are rarely buying the bean directly from the farmer. I know of people who do work with the farm cooperatives and visit the location where fermentation and drying happen. They may visit some farms. I do not know if specific batches of beans are identified with specific farms at the cooperatives. From what I have seen, they are not unless specifically sourced for a specific client. I have seen the Rizek website and they are probably labeling beans with the farm from where the harvest comes from for the premium beans. Most of what is grown is not fermented and sold in the bulk market and/or used for butter and cake. I recently visited a chocolatier in Maryland who has their own cacao farm in the DR and they use their own beans in their shop. Unless you are going to directly buy from a farmer who will harvest, ferment and dry properly, and export licenses are obtained, you will probably find it difficult to identify your beans to a specific farm.
Dear Chocolate Lifers,
I have been wondering what kind of activities are supposed to take place when chocolate makers visit farmers. I know of tours that visit plantations and seems like almost all bean to bar chocolatiers 'work with growers' and come back with smiling pictures.
While it is clear that meeting the growers, learning about their environment and practices and hopefully take actions to improve their standard of living are important, I am curious of the specific cacao processing input that they could recieve from a buyer.
I have recently been surprised to learn about the widespread existence of cacao plantations in my local Colombia, covering about 80% of the countries departments. In some cases there have been newer plantations where illegal crops are replaced with cacao. I visited some members of the Colombian Cacao Federation and they mentioned how tricky it was to change their practices when bulk buyers would purchase anything, at any state for the same price.
I wondered if some of the more experienced members could pitch in:
What has been your experience when visiting plantations for the first time?
How open were the growers to receive input from you? How easy is it to identify the varieties and the quality of their cacao production while in the visit?
How do chocolate makers learn the best practices for post-crop treatment of the beans? In the case of fermentation, is it possible to transmit a proper way of doing it as it relates to their local conditions?
Any input is appreciated, as always.
All the best,
Felipe
Once you apply for the permit, it will be reviewed at your state and federal level, and the gov't will come back with a list of conditions under which you must agree to in order to import the material. If you agree to those conditions, yes, you can import fresh pods.
Easier would be to simply order them from someone in hawaii (perhaps sharkman here).
Hi Sebastain,
Thanks for thehumorouswarning. Do you know if with an APHIS permit importation of fresh pods is permitted?
Cheers,
Scott
Hey.... You know Spider too? Wow! Small world. Tell him Brad says you can have whatever bunk you want next time or his sister doesn't get any more choklat! LOL
Know that importation of viable plant material from outside of the US without a valid USDA APHIS permit will result in the shipment being confiscated at the border. Attempting to import plant materials illegally into the US may also result in you spending some time in a 12x12 windowless concrete room will a large man named Spider, and a fight over who gets which bunk.
Hi Ning--
I tried fresh cocoa pods in Mexico and really enjoyed the pulp. Can you send fresh pods to the United States? How long do they last after being picked?
Cheers,
Scott
I would be happy to ship to you fresh / dried cocoa pods in any sizes, cut, uncut, at any ripeness, subject to harvest timing. Also available are leaves, flowers, etc. I have previously shipped to Marios Skyrianides, who is another member in Cyprus.
Check out CHEFRUBBER.com they have cocoa pods for sale under their "CHOCOLATE" catagory.
Andy
Belle Fleur Chocolate
Anyone know where I can get a couple of pods for display and education? Nothin on ebay so any other suggestions?
Thanks in advance.
Cheers
Dirke
Discovered Eataly on 25th and Broadway in NYC last week. Nice selection of Italian chocolate and confections. Bought truffles and a Barbero bar, Santo Domingo 70%. $8.80 for 3.5 oz. Very good.
Since I was in the neighborhood, I passed by Burdick and said hello to a former student of mine who works there. Purchased a Venezuelan bar and a Bolivian bar which were fantastic.
Hit Black Hound on Friday and had a few truffles. The young women who waited on me was from Haitian ethnicity and when I showed her my chocolate paste, she said her Dad brings it back from the Dominican Republic when he goes. She also gave me a white chocolate truffle which I can do without next time.
Sunday my wife and I drove to Maryland and took a Chocolate 101 class with Crisoire Reid at Spag n Vola. Her husband Eric sat down with us and was very generous with his time and advice. His partner Justin does a nice tour of their operations and is very engaging. A groups of about 12 people made ganache, rolled truffles, table tempered, and dipped. I was their mostly to meet them and was very impressed with the quality of their chocolate. They have their own farm in the DR and have complete control from tree to bon bon. You must try it.
Today I visited Fika downtown in the financial district. You can watch the chocolatier mold through a glass window. I introduced myself and he was very nice and willing to spend to time speaking with me. Fika means coffee break in Swedish. Had three truffles and a sandwich.
Hard to say exactly not knowing your storage conditions, but chances are the white powder is either yeast or mold. Pretty normal, i'd not be overly concerned unless it's fuzzy.
It does? But I have a feeling I might store it wrongly, I put it in this plastic tank, and put in some coal and those packets that absorb moisture and smell, and occasionally when it's sunny and dry outside I bring the beans out to dry (does this consider as aging?) Strangely every time when I open the lid to get the cocoa beans out, the temperature is noticeably cooler inside. Some beans have this white color covering it. After I roast the beans, some are loose, some are tight together, and some have this powdery texture (I always throw this beans with powder out) Is it usable?
Sorry that my question doesn't seem to end :S
Glad it worked! Since you pulled all the levers at once, it's hard to say which one did it 8-)
Letting dry beans age for 5 months is actually very, very good for the beans. Don't worry about that (as long as you stored them properly)
Thank you for all of your advices. It came out great, no sour or astringent taste at all! I roast the beans long enough that I can sense the changing of brownie smell turns to acidic smell and then back to brownie again. I let it conche for 34 hours, open the lid, blow in a little bit of air and hair dryer. Also added the Baking Soda. Despite it smelling like someone's smelly foot throughout the conche, I put it in the fridge and the next morning it ended up tasting good, bitter sweet.
Thank you Sebastian, thank you Richard, thank you Rodney! :D
And also my beans I brought them since October last year, and I just decided to buy a melanger so 4-5 months, I aged it a little bit too much. I think that this over fermentation of beans won't happen anymore. Thank you for all of your advices. 
Best
Panod
Dear Panod,
Perhaps you could try to increase the temperature upto 75 degrees Celcius during the grinding for some 12-24 hours? You could use a hair dryer or some other device for this, but be sure the temp goes up!
Best
Rodney Nikkels
Altering post harvest practices can have a tremendous impact on the flavor of the beans - chances are his beans are of decent bean stock, and that it's the handling after growing that would be tweaked to get him something he's after. Age of beans (both from a maturity as well as how long it's been since they were 'picked'), disease state (especially in his part of the world), fermentation quantity, configuration, and protocol are immensely important, as is drying. If he's driving down to see the plantation, it's my very strongsuspicionthat whomever is providing him with beans isn't very well versed in post harvest control, and doesn't really know what 'levers' to pull to adjust the outcome. I assume you're working with Darin at UWI - he's great - just remember that he's got a very specific field of vision (WI specific), which has lots of history with their local govt's influencing things, and the origin has somepeculiaritiesthat would have me caution you on drawing too many parallels using the results from here to other origins.
In general, i'm of the opinion that it's a much smoother road to spend the time with your supplier(s) up front to direct the outcome so that 'fixing' it later doesn't have to be done. Some 'fixes' can be affected with processing, but it's a much tougher road to travel, and there's no guarantee of success!
Thank you Sebastian for your insight, I'll keep the lid off and let it conche for ~36-48 hours. And will add baking soda after 36 hours(If it still smell bad). Like 1/2 teaspoon? I'm making a 400 g batch.
At the beginning of next month I'll be visiting the farm down south to see how they grow it. Will post pictures
Thank you Sebastian!
Just noticed your location. Do you have any insight as to how the beans were dried (or better yet, any influence over how they're dried?). Which country are the beans coming from (i'm assuming they're in your region..)
You're quite likely not doing anything wrong; what you're seeing is the result of fermentation, which generates lots of organic acids - and may have been left to go longer than it probably should have. Remember that there's no 'right' way to ferment beans - this farm you're working with may very specifically be targeting acidic beans, as that may be what someone has directed them to do in the past for a specific flavor profile, be it alone or in a blend. Or it could be that they screwed up. Hard to say w/o more details. You've got a few options you could try, i think:
1) Roast at a lower temperature, for a longer period of time. You might even consider wetting the beans a bit and trying to steam off the acetic acid by azeotroping it. I probably wouldn't start with that, but it might be something to try at a later time of other approaches don't give you what you want.
2) Take the lid off your melanage, and let it melange for 3x as long. Acetic is a fairly low molecular weight organic acid - you can tell this because you can smell it. If it wasn't, you couldn't smell it. It wants to go away. You're trapping it in by keeping the lid on, and the longer you let the cycle go, the more opportunity it will have to escape. Also consider heating environment (keep it below 160F) as heat has a direct impact on volatility.
3) Try adding a little bit of baking soda to your batch. Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) is a very weak base. You've got some acid present. Give the two a chance to dance and neutralize one another. You'll have to play with the levels, but i'd start very low.
All of those haven't been tempered yet, and right now it smell acidic and unwelcoming. :S
Hi! I really need advice.
I keep on having problems of making chocolate that taste acidic. I've made 7 batches so far.
Each with different temperature, mostly either short high or long low.
Especially the long low roast a little more than half way I get this scent of acidness and at the end resulted in a little bit of a burned brownie smell.
Many roast I would get this nice smell of chocolate aroma.
But despite all these roasting which turns up to be smelling either nutty or chocolaty smell, every batch I pour into the melanger, I would get this instant rush of acidic smell, and when it turn liquid I add in sugar I tried 70%, 62% 60% 52%(with milk powder) first 2 batch I'm surprise to see that after 6 hours I would get this fine chocolate already, but I let it run until 12 hours. All the batch after that are 20-25 hours. After conching I would pour it into a container and let it settle a bit and store it into the fridge for 2 weeks. After 2 weeks, still some acidic taste.
May I know what I did wrong. The ingredient are only beans and sugar, I have no access to lecithin or cocoa butter at all.
I mostly keep the lid on, because I let it run over night, and it make a lot of mess when open. I sometimes use the hair dryer like 5-10 minutes.
I also look at the farm that supply the beans and it is certified by the local research center for quality.
What could be wrong? The conching time is not enough? More hair dryer? Longer and hotter roast? Need to open the lid?
Thank you in advance for all of your advices.
I was looking for classes preferably in NJ that would one day make me a Chocolate Jedi but unfortunately I haven't been able to find anything.
